Question about demons

[Nicky1337s]

Hello Sister and Brother , ihave a question about demons . Satan=beezebul=lucifer=baal ,is this true ? What do you think ? İs this true or not ?

 

[Faria]

List a couple of books you've read cover to cover in search of this information.

 

[Nicky1337s]

List a couple of books you've read cover to cover in search of this information.

Which book can you have any recommend ?

 

[Faria]

There are quite a few threads here with book recommendations.

 

[HoldAll]

@Faria's response is entirely understandable and apposite. It's such a complex subject, and frankly your question sounds like the ones that get asked on Reddit where the person has not even studied the relevant Wikipedia entries or at least run on-topic Google searches, let alone read books on the topic and merely seeks to get spoonfed information. There was even a discussion here whether Lucifer was god:

Have you ever thought that Lucifer is god?

"It is a gnostic perspective because my beliefs are biased toward it, but what if it is true? If you read some of the gnostic gospels, especially the one where Jesus reveals how was the creation of the world, technically the demiurge is the serpent of the Tree of Knowledge. Moreover, it turns...

wizardforums.com

Right on top of my head, I mainly think of "The Satan: How God's Executioner Became the Enemy" by by Ryan E. Stokes; there's another book I don't remember right now that states that Satan wasn't such a big deal in the Christian bible and definitely not god's powerful antagonist he's considered today, that "Lucifer" was nothing but a translation error for sb. mentioned in a bible or psalm passage that actually referred to king Nebuchadnezzar of Babylon (also brought up in some discussion here somewhere), followed by assorted all-out bible debunking like in the case of "Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live" where it was shown that "witch" actually signified "poisoner", 'counter-debunked' by Christian fundies who proved that the Hebrew word actually came from ancient Sumerian and meant "witch" after all, etc. Definitely be sure to study scholarly books, Christian, Luciferian or Satanist ones are more about religios faith than mythological fact, if such a thing exists.

Short answer: you can spend months researching that question, we won't do it for you.

Post automatically merged: Mar 16, 2025

One quick note: according to Gershom Scholem, the devil was hardly ever a thing for the old Jewish kabbalists; when discussing the Lurianic quliphoth, he only mentions 'demonic forces', not some evil evil mastermind.

 

[Nicky1337s]

@Faria'ın yanıtı tamamen anlaşılır ve yerindedir. Bu çok karmaşık bir konu ve açıkçası sorunuz, kişinin bırakın konuyla ilgili kitapları okumayı ve yalnızca arama yapmayı, ilgili Wikipedia girişlerini incelemediği veya en azından konu üzerinde Google aramaları yapmadığı Reddit'te sorulan sorulara benziyor. kaşıkla beslenen bilgiler elde etmek için. Hatta burada Lucifer'in tanrı olup olmadığı konusunda bir tartışma bile vardı:

Have you ever thought that Lucifer is god?

"It is a gnostic perspective because my beliefs are biased toward it, but what if it is true? If you read some of the gnostic gospels, especially the one where Jesus reveals how was the creation of the world, technically the demiurge is the serpent of the Tree of Knowledge. Moreover, it turns...

wizardforums.com

Esas olarak kafamın üstünde düşünüyorum "Şeytan: Allah'ın Celladı Nasıl Düşman Oldu" tarafından Ryan E. Stokes; Şeytan'ın Hıristiyan İncil'inde o kadar da önemli olmadığını ve kesinlikle Tanrı'nın bugün düşündüğü güçlü düşmanı olmadığını, "Lucifer" in sb. için bir çeviri hatasından başka bir şey olmadığını belirten, şu anda hatırlamadığım başka bir kitap daha var. Aslında Babil Kralı Nebuchadnezzar'a atıfta bulunan bir İncil veya mezmur pasajında bahsedilmiştir (aynı zamanda burada bir yerde bazı tartışmalarda da gündeme getirilmiştir), bunu, "cadı" kelimesinin aslında "zehirleyici" anlamına geldiğinin, İbranice kelimesinin aslında "zehirleyici" anlamına geldiğini kanıtlayan Hıristiyan fundies tarafından "karşı çürütülmüş" olduğunun gösterildiği "Yaşamak için bir cadıya acı çekmeyeceksin" örneğindeki gibi çeşitli topyekün İncil çürütmeleri izledi. aslında eski Sümerce'den geldi ve sonuçta "cadı" anlamına geliyordu, vb. Kesinlikle bilimsel kitapları incelediğinizden emin olun, Hıristiyan, Luciferian veya Satanist olanlar mitolojik gerçeklerden çok dini inançla ilgilidir, eğer böyle bir şey varsa.

Kısa cevap: bu soruyu araştırmak için aylarca harcayabilirsiniz, bunu sizin için yapmayacağız.
[otomeraj]1742118446[/otomeraj]
Kısa bir not: Gershom Scholem'e göre şeytan, eski Yahudi kabalistler için neredeyse hiçbir zaman bir şey değildi; Lurianic quliphoth'u tartışırken, kötü kötü bir beyinden değil, yalnızca 'şeytani güçlerden' bahseder.

İ'm not say this, joyofsatan members say that, i'm research ,this informaion true or not

 

[Amur]

I would say that Beelzebub and Satan are the same, Lucifer is something else, Baal is an old type of Demon. For a quickfix for you.

 

[Nicky1337s]

I would say that Beelzebub and Satan are the same, Lucifer is something else. For a quickfix for you.

Thanks, have a good day

 

[HoldAll]

You can safely ignore what believers say (in this case a bunch of antisemitic neonazi white supremacists), better stick to scholars of religion and the like. With those people, it's always "Satan wants you to..." without any evidence whatsoever, or by giving an antinomin twist to bible quotes (theistic Satanists seem to cling to the bible more desperately than Christians, it seems).

Also see my darque fluff collection if you must:

Collection - Popular Satanism

This post is somewhat embarrassing. I originally began to collect those books in an attempt to highlight my feeling that cheap hacks had recently begun to exploit the word 'Satanism' solely for its shock value, spewing out 'dark' fluff with little or no substance. However, a few of them seem to...

wizardforums.com

Post automatically merged: Mar 16, 2025

Avoid those JoS "Hail Satan!" screamers is my advice.

 

[Nicky1337s]

You can safely ignore what believers say (in this case a bunch of antisemitic neonazi white supremacists), better stick to scholars of religion and the like. With those people, it's always "Satan wants you to..." without any evidence whatsoever, or by giving an antinomin twist to bible quotes (theistic Satanists seem to cling to the bible more desperately than Christians, it seems).

Also see my darque fluff collection if you must:

Collection - Popular Satanism

This post is somewhat embarrassing. I originally began to collect those books in an attempt to highlight my feeling that cheap hacks had recently begun to exploit the word 'Satanism' solely for its shock value, spewing out 'dark' fluff with little or no substance. However, a few of them seem to...

wizardforums.com

Post automatically merged: Mar 16, 2025

Avoid those JoS "Hail Satan!" screamers is my advice.

Thanks

Post automatically merged: Mar 16, 2025

You can safely ignore what believers say (in this case a bunch of antisemitic neonazi white supremacists), better stick to scholars of religion and the like. With those people, it's always "Satan wants you to..." without any evidence whatsoever, or by giving an antinomin twist to bible quotes (theistic Satanists seem to cling to the bible more desperately than Christians, it seems).

Also see my darque fluff collection if you must:

Collection - Popular Satanism

This post is somewhat embarrassing. I originally began to collect those books in an attempt to highlight my feeling that cheap hacks had recently begun to exploit the word 'Satanism' solely for its shock value, spewing out 'dark' fluff with little or no substance. However, a few of them seem to...

wizardforums.com

Post automatically merged: Mar 16, 2025

Avoid those JoS "Hail Satan!" screamers is my advice.

I know it's stupid, but I performed a joyofsatan dedication ritual with the help of a friend, you know, like "the devil gives you what you want", is there any way back from that? I mean, something like cancelling the dedication ritual

 

[Faria]

Thanks

Post automatically merged: Mar 16, 2025

I know it's stupid, but I performed a joyofsatan dedication ritual with the help of a friend, you know, like "the devil gives you what you want", is there any way back from that? I mean, something like cancelling the dedication ritual

Got all the love, money, and power you ever wanted? No? Then maybe he didn't keep his end of the deal and you therefore don't owe him squat.

 

[Nicky1337s]

İstediğiniz tüm sevgiye, paraya ve güce sahip misiniz? Hayır mı? O zaman belki de anlaşmanın kendisine düşen kısmını yerine getirmedi ve bu nedenle ona çömelme borcunuz yok.

Can you explain in a little detail?

 

[Faria]

Can you explain in a little detail?

What needs explaining? If you make a deal or an offer and the other party fails to fulfill it, you have no contract, it's null and void.

 

[Nicky1337s]

What needs explaining? If you make a deal or an offer and the other party fails to fulfill it, you have no contract, it's null and void.

İ see thanks

 

[HoldAll]

I know it's stupid, but I performed a joyofsatan dedication ritual with the help of a friend, you know, like "the devil gives you what you want", is there any way back from that? I mean, something like cancelling the dedication ritual

No idea really. It's one thing to discuss mythology and another one to actually use it in practice. 'Dedication ritual' sounds a bit like selling your soul to the devil, only for free or at least in lieu of unspecified services yet to be rendered, or deciding to go over to the Dark Side for good. The classic method (which is actually required in some highly forgettable book I uploaded here ages ago) would be saying the Lord's Prayer backwards, thus forfeiting your immortal soul forever. I can well imagine that those JoS dimwits are into that, the simple-minded reasoning being that what you'll likely to be craving is 'sinful' by medieval Abrahamic standards (money, sex, power, etc.), so it makes sense, again in that narrow antiquated mindset, to address your wishes to the devil and submit to him completely.

Just reciting the words you found in a book somewhere won't do anything if you don't mean them deep down, in the core of your being. There is an ongoing debate here whether altered states of consciousness are required for a magical operation but I'd say for such an 'infernal dedication ritual', the traditional method would probably be going to a crossroads at midnight, sacrificing a black rooster, smearing an inverted pentagram on the ground with its blood, saying the Lord's Prayer backwards of course as well as possibly also doing the whole thing naked; the point is to induce stark terror (= altered state of consciousness) and create a traumatic experience you'll never forget. I really doubt that anyone without training and experience can muster the required emotional intensity without all that gory horror stuff.

Do you feel committed to the devil? Do you feel you made a life-changing irreversible decision? If the answer is 'no', you have nothing to fear except your own superstitions.

 

[Nicky1337s]

Hiçbir fikir gerçekten. Mitolojiyi tartışmak başka bir şey, onu pratikte kullanmak başka bir şey. ‘Adanmışlık ritüeli’ biraz ruhunuzu şeytana satmaya benziyor, sadece bedava ya da en azından henüz verilmemiş belirtilmemiş hizmetler yerine ya da Karanlık Tarafa temelli gitmeye karar vermek. Klasik yöntem (aslında yıllar önce buraya yüklediğim son derece unutulabilir bazı kitaplarda gerekli olan) Rab'bin Duasını tersten söylemek, böylece ölümsüz ruhunuzu sonsuza kadar kaybetmek olacaktır. JoS aptallarının bununla ilgilendiğini pekala hayal edebiliyorum, basit fikirli akıl yürütme, arzulayacağınız şeyin ortaçağ İbrahimi standartlarına (para, seks, güç vb.) göre 'günahkar' olduğu yönündedir, bu yüzden bu mantıklı geliyor, yine o dar, modası geçmiş zihniyette, isteklerinizi şeytana yöneltmek ve ona tamamen boyun eğmek.

Sadece bir yerde bir kitapta bulduğunuz kelimeleri okumak, onları derinlerde, varlığınızın özünde kastetmiyorsanız hiçbir şey yapmaz. Burada büyülü bir operasyon için değişen bilinç durumlarının gerekli olup olmadığı konusunda devam eden bir tartışma var ama böyle bir 'cehennemsel adanma ritüeli' için geleneksel yöntemin muhtemelen gece yarısı bir yol ayrımına gitmek, siyah bir horozu feda etmek, ters bir pentagramı yere kanıyla sürmek, Rab'bin Duasını elbette tersten söylemek ve muhtemelen her şeyi çıplak yapmak olacağını söyleyebilirim; önemli olan, keskin bir terör yaratmak (= bilinç durumunu değiştirdi) ve asla unutamayacağınız travmatik bir deneyim yaratmaktır. Eğitimi ve deneyimi olmayan herkesin, tüm bu kanlı korku şeyleri olmadan gerekli duygusal yoğunluğu toplayabileceğinden gerçekten şüpheliyim.

Şeytana bağlı hissediyor musun? Hayatınızı değiştirecek geri dönüşü olmayan bir karar verdiğinizi hissediyor musunuz? Cevap ‘hayır’ ise, kendi batıl inançlarınız dışında korkacak hiçbir şeyiniz yoktur.

Yes my answer is no

Post automatically merged: Mar 16, 2025

No idea really. It's one thing to discuss mythology and another one to actually use it in practice. 'Dedication ritual' sounds a bit like selling your soul to the devil, only for free or at least in lieu of unspecified services yet to be rendered, or deciding to go over to the Dark Side for good. The classic method (which is actually required in some highly forgettable book I uploaded here ages ago) would be saying the Lord's Prayer backwards, thus forfeiting your immortal soul forever. I can well imagine that those JoS dimwits are into that, the simple-minded reasoning being that what you'll likely to be craving is 'sinful' by medieval Abrahamic standards (money, sex, power, etc.), so it makes sense, again in that narrow antiquated mindset, to address your wishes to the devil and submit to him completely.

Just reciting the words you found in a book somewhere won't do anything if you don't mean them deep down, in the core of your being. There is an ongoing debate here whether altered states of consciousness are required for a magical operation but I'd say for such an 'infernal dedication ritual', the traditional method would probably be going to a crossroads at midnight, sacrificing a black rooster, smearing an inverted pentagram on the ground with its blood, saying the Lord's Prayer backwards of course as well as possibly also doing the whole thing naked; the point is to induce stark terror (= altered state of consciousness) and create a traumatic experience you'll never forget. I really doubt that anyone without training and experience can muster the required emotional intensity without all that gory horror stuff.

Do you feel committed to the devil? Do you feel you made a life-changing irreversible decision? If the answer is 'no', you have nothing to fear except your own superstitions.

Ahh i rememver they call themselves zevist,(old JoS members), because satan is zeus=baalzebul=lucifer=poseidonand bla bla bla..... they new age nam is temple of zeus , chnage JoS to ToZ thats all

 

[silencewaits]

Hello Sister and Brother , ihave a question about demons . Satan=beezebul=lucifer=baal ,is this true ? What do you think ? İs this true or not ?

Ba'al is a title meaning 'lord'. Beelzebub means something like Ba'al Zebub. Satan was originally a title or noun meaning adversary or accuser. Lucifer's a mistranslation that acquired traits from a figure of the same name. Ha-Satan and Lucifer were conflated; Ba'al and Beelzebub became demons.

 

[Nicky1337s]

Ba'al is a title meaning 'lord'. Beelzebub means something like Ba'al Zebub. Satan was originally a title or noun meaning adversary or accuser. Lucifer's a mistranslation that acquired traits from a figure of the same name. Ha-Satan and Lucifer were conflated; Ba'al and Beelzebub became demons.

Thanks

 

[Sabbatius]

Ba'al as stated above just means "Lord" or more commonly, "Master". This was a title associated with the spirit of areas, regions, natural hot spots like mountains, groves, streams, crevices and crags- all within the areas in and around Canaan. The Ba'als of the Tanakh were various. Various Masters of mountains, hill, valleys, and earthen openings were numerous.

Ba'al Zebub/Ba'al'tse'vul is the Master of the Heavens, not flies as often described. It was common for the Hebrews to utilize changing simplistic endings to mock deities of other nations, hence the bastardization of Astarte(Shining) with As(h)toreth(Shame).

The most amount of documentation discovered thus far for a Ba'al is Ba'al Haddad from the Ras Shamra excavations. Ba'al Haddad is, by definition, the most enigmatic entities of the Canaanite pantheon and was highly mimicked by YHVH as the Yahwists who invaded Canaan from Midian. This was the Ba'al whom the Prphet Elijah challenged on Mt. Carmel in the Book of Kings with bringing down fire upon the altars for burnt offerings.

 

[William66]

Hello Sister and Brother , ihave a question about demons . Satan=beezebul=lucifer=baal ,is this true ? What do you think ? İs this true or not ?

Hello, peace be upon you.

If you mean ”are they the same spirit?”.

They have their owns seats tartarus, Satan and Lucifer has their own seats/rule etc, but personally you can be a bodyguard and a school teacher, maybe Lucifer and Satan are the same, maybe not in essence, Lucifer is more ”bright”.
Beezebul has a seat too and i personally dont think he is the same Bael since he is a king from goetia first demon, and beezelbul is in the seat = higher, if you mean Baal on the other hand then possible, i have seen many mix Baal/Beezelbul.

Tartarus seats positions can give you more detail on that, the rest is personal thinking opinion.