Physically spirit evocation

[boom2]

I know saying physical appearance is something that has been debating a while ago in the community, we have John R King and Julio Cesar Ody confirming its possible and others saying spirit can only shows sign but cant show physically to have a real decent conversation without any mirror o skry ball... What is your thoughts and experience? Would like to give it a try

 

[FireBorn]

I’ve had plenty of encounters where I see spirits—not with my physical eyes, but in what some call the mind’s eye or third eye. Use whatever language tracks with you. The experience is absolutely real to me, even if it doesn’t line up with someone else’s idea of what “physical” means.

As for citing names, no offense to John R. King or Julio Cesar Ody, but why does it matter what they say? Are they some kind of ultimate authority on how spirits can or can’t appear? I don’t believe anyone gets to own that seat on the pretend throne of occult knowledge.

Personally, I reject external scaffolding, even the so-called sacred grimoires. Why? Because I want the experience to be raw and pure. Other people’s frameworks are just more lenses layered over my own, and that usually leads to frustration, not clarity. That’s just how it works for me. YMMV.


Try it however you need to. You’ll be fine. But try it. It’s a gas!

 

[Morell]

It is quite possible for you to see a spirit as if it were fully physical - to see it just like any human. But it is little different than you think. It's not that much them appearing fully physically (although that too is possible I guess) and more you developing your senses to be able to detect spirits.

Some people first develop seeing, some hearing, some get both at once I guess. I can only see them and I recon that they are not physical, though I cannot see through them. I guess that hearing is yet to develop for me.

My personal way of developing the senses is through meditation, when I move my focus or consciousness more into my spiritual bodies, thus using their senses which helps the development. At least that is my theory of it.

 

[boom2]

I’ve had plenty of encounters where I see spirits—not with my physical eyes, but in what some call the mind’s eye or third eye. Use whatever language tracks with you. The experience is absolutely real to me, even if it doesn’t line up with someone else’s idea of what “physical” means.

As for citing names, no offense to John R. King or Julio Cesar Ody, but why does it matter what they say? Are they some kind of ultimate authority on how spirits can or can’t appear? I don’t believe anyone gets to own that seat on the pretend throne of occult knowledge.

Personally, I reject external scaffolding, even the so-called sacred grimoires. Why? Because I want the experience to be raw and pure. Other people’s frameworks are just more lenses layered over my own, and that usually leads to frustration, not clarity. That’s just how it works for me. YMMV.


Try it however you need to. You’ll be fine. But try it. It’s a gas!

Thanks for answer.. but its matter because we are talking a method , a way of working with spirit... The subject is not about if your magic works, it's about physical evocation experience

Post automatically merged: Tuesday at 12:29 PM

@julio

 

[Faria]

we have John R King and Julio Cesar Ody confirming its possible

Could you provide a quote from either author stating their belief that the spirits are physically there? I don't mean seeing and hearing, but physical presence, and a direct quote saying that.

As far as I know, both speak of visible and audible experiences of spirits or ghosts, and allow for the possibility of that being a physical experience, but neither insist on that being the case.

 

[FireBorn]

Did a quick dive into Ody, yeah, I see where that angle comes from now. But honestly, I still have no idea who John R. King is. You sure that’s the right name? I couldn’t find much of anything credible or widely known.

Anyway, back to the main point. When we talk about physical manifestations during evocation, you immediately run into a deeper question:

What counts as physical?

Is it:

• Someone else seeing the same spirit you evoked?
• A somatic reaction in your body? (pressure changes, temperature shifts, nausea, ecstasy)
• Feeling touched? (Clairsentience, yeah, I’ve had that too.)
• Or something like a spirit moving a physical object in the room?

And does any of it count as "proof" if it only happens to you? Or does it have to be witnessed by others to cross into the objective?

Because if we’re saying full-on shared physical manifestation is the goal, one that multiple people can see, document, and agree on then we’re not talking about magick anymore. We’re talking about a repeatable technology. A physics problem. Something that leaves the liminal and lands squarely in the lab. I would think that after the industrial revolution, we would have solved it by now if it were solvable by science. I could be wrong, but its its either not solvable, or not enough interest to dedicate resources into its solution.

And if we get there? Then mystery dies. Then we lose the multiplicity of paths. Then it’s no longer about gnosis, trust, communion, or fire. It’s about replicable method. It becomes a thing we do to get a result.

And I think when that happens, the soul of the work disappears. The very thing that makes this sacred, its wildness, its personalness, its refusal to be pinned down, gets sanitized. Would it make demons more, or something less?

Just my 2 cents.

 

[Faria]

But honestly, I still have no idea who John R. King is. You sure that’s the right name?

Try johnrkingiv.com.

Known for being the first (maybe only?) printed account of someone doing the Goetia thing according to the book. Lion skins. Gold medallions. Linen robes. First hand accounts of going back and forth with spirits over several years with extensive commentaries on the results.

 

[HoldAll]

Did a quick dive into Ody, yeah, I see where that angle comes from now. But honestly, I still have no idea who John R. King is. You sure that’s the right name? I couldn’t find much of anything credible or widely known.

We have his "Imperial Arts" (a bit dubious if you ask me) as well as his "The Faculty of Abrac" (less sensationalist) in the Library if you want to take a gander.