Are There any safe Goetia spirits?

[Lion]

Which Goetia spirit is the safest and least likely to give you a hard time ? I was wondering about Phenex; has anybody worked with Phenex?

 

[Lucien6493]

Receiving information that makes zero sense at the moment. It unfolds in time, as you grow or are ready. Note: This is how Raziel and Asteroth taught ME. This in no way intimates that either would teach others (you) in the same way. Although I do know a few others who have had similar experiences with either of those two spirits. Not a rule is what I am saying, some call it UPG or unverified personal gnosis.

I can verify that. My deepest apologies!

To the devil with verification though. The moment it can be verified it is no longer gnosis. It becomes something curated, categorized and safe. The imaginal is not safe, and Astaroth is not someone I would invite home to meet my mother. She is a trickster spirit. So is Astaroth, and I love her dearly, and if I ever confused the two, or equated them, then magick was not something I should have ever taken up.

To to address the original post, no demon is safe. Neither is your life, nor your relationships, let alone your bullshit, most of which is passed on to you by those who have a vested interest in making you safe for themselves, because engaging the demonic is like jamming the Blues, not like dear Abby. It's messy, its intense, it hurts. It's lots of smoke, cold beer and bad lighting. If it makes you feel comfortable try Tinder. That is really scary!

 

[Firetree]

Receiving information that makes zero sense at the moment. It unfolds in time, as you grow or are ready. Note: This is how Raziel and Asteroth taught ME. This in no way intimates that either would teach others (you) in the same way. Although I do know a few others who have had similar experiences with either of those two spirits. Not a rule is what I am saying, some call it UPG or unverified personal gnosis.

Same for me ( Your first two sentences ) . After many years I started referring to the process as a 'download ' - after many years, as , when it happened 'downloads' were not invented yet . I remember a beam of white light hitting me in the forehead , a 'white out' , an energy rush into my ' head' , a noise I could not identify except as chaotic, fast and seeming like a series of different soundings bips, clicks, and ' short wave radio static ' ( back then, that was the only thing I could compare it to ) . Apparent time loss , not to me though I thought the whole process took a few seconds but observers said otherwise ; I was standing there staring 'for ages ' and could not hear the people calling to me .

Decades later , I grabbed a cassette tape of the shelf and out it in the player ... to my shock that sound ( or something very similar to it ) came out the speakers .... WTF is that ! A flatmate came bolting in (as I had it up loud and it was his sound system ) and asked me what I had done to his sound system and shut it off . I told him what happened and he pulled the tape out and looked at it ; ' No wonder ! ' he said and then explained it was a 'computer tape ' with a program on it .

( no I am not making that up ;

- not anything like Raziel or Asteroth though . I had no idea at the time , it took me decades to , sort of , reverse engineer 'who' it was and what form they were taking ( and the reason for that became very apparent after a fuller examination of my natal chart ) .

I am wondering, if in your experience , you can at times 'access' parts of that download information , either by conscious contact with your 'storage facility ' , or by surfacing from the 'unconscious' spontaneously or in times of need ( especially 'dire need' ) ?

 

[FireBorn]

I am wondering, if in your experience , you can at times 'access' parts of that download information , either by conscious contact with your 'storage facility ' , or by surfacing from the 'unconscious' spontaneously or in times of need ( especially 'dire need' ) ?

Honestly, thats a cool question, and I dont really have an answer. The downloads were visual and somatic shapes and vibrations. Only a few have been revealed, or unfolded (if that is even the right term for it) but months later. Not the thread for it, but it would be cool to compare notes.

 

[Firetree]

Honestly, thats a cool question, and I dont really have an answer. The downloads were visual and somatic shapes and vibrations. Only a few have been revealed, or unfolded (if that is even the right term for it) but months later. Not the thread for it, but it would be cool to compare notes.

yeah ok, I dont know what to call a thread like that though , if you start one I will contribute . Notify me if you do .

For me any 'spirit' ( whatever we might want to classify it as ) is 'safe' depending on their works ( results ) , unfortunately judged in retrospect . However during the process we might be able to discern that .

I fully ascribe to Dr VanDusens * clinical observations in that , whether it is regarded as a 'spirit' or 'hallucination', the same 'rules' apply and one is that there are spirits of a 'good order' and a 'bad order' .... obviously the good order is 'safe' and the bad order not ( when one considers the why of the classification ) .

*

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

 

[Lucien6493]

@Firetree and @FireBorn if you take situational awareness (reading the field for patterns) and add to it an acute awareness of the inner senses then what we call spirits may well be our ability to interact with the intelligence of the complex system within which we are embedded, in which case the word "safe" does not apply. Why? Because the field is not a danger to itself. Danger and safety only makes sense if you have convinced yourself that you are separate from the very environment you inhabit. It certainly feels that way, but this may well be a perceptual hallucination. If we look at magick not as something we do but as an interface event...as one part of a complex system talking to another another part of itself the danger of being overwhelmed does not exist because communication can only happen (from our side) if our integrity as a complex system is maintained. Inner and outer (inner senses and field awareness) are two ways of looking at the same thing. Of course, there is the madness of spirits to deal with and the stress of holding yourself together while being Present but that is, to my mind, Shadow work. It can't be avoided.