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[Opinion] Our Strength is Diver---wait a minnit...

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Xenophon

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Just about everyone agrees---from Franz Fanon on the left to awful neo-Nazi mage David Myatt on the right: one of the cause of Africa's ills has been imperialists lumping together different tribal groups at random, and later saying such arbitrary groupings were now "countries." Some peoples have histories of enmity, some are coldly indifferent to continued association, some are incompatible. Got it. Check.

So...why is importing even larger collections of clashing cultures into the West somehow a sacred shibboleth, the last divinity, rose-spectacled Diversity? Bitter bloodshed at the Hotel Rwanda is a bad but at, say, Fawlty Towers it's "socially progressive"? Got it. Check. The post-modern social contract is a suicide pact.
 

8Lou1

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think business. for every imported human there is a wallet to pay for expenses and the business world quite likes the profit. money needs to roll and labels are needed to know what subsidy to ask the EU.
 

Xenophon

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think business. for every imported human there is a wallet to pay for expenses and the business world quite likes the profit. money needs to roll and labels are needed to know what subsidy to ask the EU.
I am into the aesthetics of existence, not prostitution draped in film-flimsy rationalization. Controlled immigration might be defensible; what we have now is betrayal by our ruling synhedrions.
 

8Lou1

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would you be able to name them, instead of staying vague?i sadly was asked what i like better to watch: biden and putin or trump and putin. i choose the latter as i like the media spiel. nothing else.
 

pixel_fortune

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Aging population. Countries with aging populations need to import young people from other countries.

Encouraging people in Western countries to have more babies a) won't work, we don't want to b) takes 20 years and c) seems silly when the earth is overpopulated. Redistribution makes more sense, and you're not going to get young people from Scandinavia or wherever would be more acceptable to you, because they also have aging populations

If you don't want immigration, you need to find another solution to the looming ageing crisis. Clones?
 

Xenophon

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Maybe because in this case, the people want to be here.
The wants of A create no responsibility on B's part. I'd like to be a count living in South Tyrol, but the damned Italians blithely trample my rights and won't give it to me.
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Also, capitalism is addicted to cheap labour.
One more reason to cull the capitalists, no?
 

Robert Ramsay

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The wants of A create no responsibility on B's part. I'd like to be a count living in South Tyrol, but the damned Italians blithely trample my rights and won't give it to me.
I meant as opposed to your example of African countries where, as you rightly say, people were just stuck together by colonialists.
 

Xingtian

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In the case of European imperialism in Africa, the problem was not merely artificially drawing borders and throwing together people who had nothing to do with each other, but playing groups off of each other and cultivating a minority that was dependent and subservient to the colonial power. This not only made it easier to rule but easier to keep the colony pliant even after independence. In other cases the divisions were actively fomented in societies that were relatively cohesive. When the threat of independence came these divisions could be used to effect a partition.
 

neilwilkes

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Just about everyone agrees---from Franz Fanon on the left to awful neo-Nazi mage David Myatt on the right: one of the cause of Africa's ills has been imperialists lumping together different tribal groups at random, and later saying such arbitrary groupings were now "countries." Some peoples have histories of enmity, some are coldly indifferent to continued association, some are incompatible. Got it. Check.

So...why is importing even larger collections of clashing cultures into the West somehow a sacred shibboleth, the last divinity, rose-spectacled Diversity? Bitter bloodshed at the Hotel Rwanda is a bad but at, say, Fawlty Towers it's "socially progressive"? Got it. Check. The post-modern social contract is a suicide pact.
And an even bigger cause of Poverty in Africa was the way so many newly independent states went to the Marxist/Socialist ideology.
There is a wonderful presentation from a Senegalese woman entrepeneur talking about how Senegal is still so over-regulated she cannot hire or fire anybody without the permission of a government official who has never run his own business in his entire life yuet has absolute control over what she can do. It takes 2 years to set up a company in Senegal against 20 minutes in UK/USA.
People need to get over the whole colonial BS
 

Xingtian

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And an even bigger cause of Poverty in Africa was the way so many newly independent states went to the Marxist/Socialist ideology.
There is a wonderful presentation from a Senegalese woman entrepeneur talking about how Senegal is still so over-regulated she cannot hire or fire anybody without the permission of a government official who has never run his own business in his entire life yuet has absolute control over what she can do. It takes 2 years to set up a company in Senegal against 20 minutes in UK/USA.
People need to get over the whole colonial BS

Won’t someone think of the poor entrepreneurs
 

SkullTraill

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Aging population. Countries with aging populations need to import young people from other countries.

Encouraging people in Western countries to have more babies a) won't work, we don't want to b) takes 20 years and c) seems silly when the earth is overpopulated. Redistribution makes more sense, and you're not going to get young people from Scandinavia or wherever would be more acceptable to you, because they also have aging populations

If you don't want immigration, you need to find another solution to the looming ageing crisis. Clones?
I do agree with this. Importing people is a viable short term solution for countries with really poor birthrates. I'm looking at Germany, South Korea, Japan etc. There's just something about the more educated + more liberal = less birth that seems easy to solve with the less educated + less liberal = more babymaking. However, countries do need to consider their own identity, and the long term ramifications of unchecked immigration... that is, if they really truly care about their genetic and cultural identity.

That being said, I have an even more controversial perspective on this, which is that the Earth belongs to us all, and yes, borders matter for economic, political, and military reasons, but for almost all of history, humans were free to walk and travel the world, to leave their place of birth and settle down somewhere else and start a new settlement etc. Then eventually there came a point where most of the known world was already "settled" or "claimed" and it became harder to just waltz somewhere and do your own thing (you could do it as an individual up until maybe a few centuries ago, but it was impossible to start your own "nation" so to speak, for a while now) however, before the UN, wars of conquest were a thing, and if you had enough people in your army, and you really wanted to be in some particular place, you could try your hand at taking it by force. IMHO, this was reasonably fair, and allowed people to move freely and settle freely provided they had enough people to do so. It became a little less fair with modern technological progress creating vast discrepancies between various nations, but still, the world had a way of balancing it all out.

It pisses me off to no end, that now that the "world powers" are comfortable in their little seats, they decided to ban conquest, and post-911 the constriction of the ability to freely travel. And for that reason, I think some countries/cultures have resorted to "conquest by immigration" which I think is actually fair, given that that's the only option people have now.

I absolutely don't believe in the concept of sovereignty as a right. I believe that sovereignty must be fought for and defended, and decaying/collapsing empires deserve to be invaded/occupied and succeeded by superior military, cultural, or political forces. That has been the way of human evolution throughout history, and is a critical catalyst in the betterment of cultures/societies via survival of the fittest. The lack of which has caused undeniable stagnation and corruption of western civilisations.

Yes, it makes me personally sad to see the demise and steady erasure of western culture, history and architecture, but it is the way of the universe. What cannot be defended does not deserve to exist. Fuck it.
 

Xingtian

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Not only does the earth belong to us all, but borders, along with states, nations, etc are in fact completely unnecessary and are nowadays totally arbitrary instruments in the hands of capital which has no provincial prejudices even as it benefits from fomenting them among its slaves. “Western culture” is another empty concept which is indefensible not because its heirs are anemic or pusillanimous but because it’s incapable of being coherently and consistently defined.
 

Taudefindi

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Aging population. Countries with aging populations need to import young people from other countries.
Countries like Japan and S.Korea for example will suffer of it in the coming years due to the decrease of children.China already suffers due to the the big difference in numbers of men and women.

If they don't implement policies to make life easier for people(better salaries, less work hours, cheaper housing and etc. so they can actually be able to have kid$, it is as you say.They'll need to bring in immigrants least their countries starts to age faster and faster and soon there won't be the minimum necessary amount of young blood to even make the country run properly.

Also, capitalism is addicted to cheap labour.
More like it is the reason it makes the profits it makes.

“Western culture” is another empty concept
I don't know if it is "empty" but it certainly is one that seems to be a little disrespectful.

After all "The West" is big and we have many ethnicities and cultures in it, so to boil it all down to one single "culture", as if they were all the same seems to ignore the mix that actually is The West.
 

Xenophon

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Not only does the earth belong to us all, but borders, along with states, nations, etc are in fact completely unnecessary and are nowadays totally arbitrary instruments in the hands of capital which has no provincial prejudices even as it benefits from fomenting them among its slaves. “Western culture” is another empty concept which is indefensible not because its heirs are anemic or pusillanimous but because it’s incapable of being coherently and consistently defined.
It's capable of being coherently and consistently lived, which is all any culture ever needed. If you can't hack it, so be it.
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It's capable of being coherently and consistently lived, which is all any culture ever needed. If you can't hack it, so be it.
It's like "gangstah." Unmistakable to spot; elusive of academic definition. Even the most exhaustive cataloguing of traits calls forth a, "Nah, that ain't gangstah!"

I mean hey, we all saw THIS game played in college. A professor wants to dismiss something he can't abide. So he says, "Define it." Then it's off to the races round a meandering track. Look at Plato's dialogues. Endless discussion to define common terms and generally ending with head scratching. Not for nothing did the ancient school of the Skeptics claim Plato as their founder.
 
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SkullTraill

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I don't know if it is "empty" but it certainly is one that seems to be a little disrespectful.

After all "The West" is big and we have many ethnicities and cultures in it, so to boil it all down to one single "culture", as if they were all the same seems to ignore the mix that actually is The West.
I don't think most people who use the term "western culture" are implying that there is only one culture in the west. Certainly, I wasn't. It's just a phrase used to generally refer to a group of cultures, and the meaning/intention of my earlier post wouldn't have been impacted in any significant way if I had chosen to just list out 10-50 different cultures.

Endless discussion to define common terms and generally ending with head scratching.
I know, right? It's silly that we can't engage in general discussions about common concepts that anyone with basic common sense would be able to understand the intention behind, without someone coming to nitpick some almost irrelevant semantic non-issue to be offended by. It's so funny that the rest of my post actually contains an extremely controversial (in modern times) point of view that is worth arguing and debating about, but instead the only argument I got was "tHeRe iS nO SUcH tHiNG aS wEsTErN cuLtuRe".

Ridiculous.

“Western culture” is another empty concept which is indefensible not because its heirs are anemic or pusillanimous but because it’s incapable of being coherently and consistently defined.
What a truly delusional take. You can read the broad understanding of western culture and its historic defensibility here:
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Anyway, I think the US, Canada, and most countries in Europe are in the "late stage civilisation" phase and the real answer to the original post is "well, what are you/we gonna do about it". My guess is the answer is "nothing" and there will be a resurgence of one or more Eastern cultures in the coming decades/centuries.
 
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Xingtian

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It's capable of being coherently and consistently lived

Evidently not since its most fanatical exponents are continually plundering “the East” for ideas.

a truly delusional take. You can read the broad understanding of western culture and its historic defensibility here:
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Did you read that article? It’s a hilarious mess. And so many contortions to exclude Orthodox Christianity and Islam.

Anyway, I think the US, Canada, and most countries in Europe are in the "late stage civilisation" phase

May they die!
 

Xenophon

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Evidently not since its most fanatical exponents are continually plundering “the East” for ideas.



Did you read that article? It’s a hilarious mess. And so many contortions to exclude Orthodox Christianity and Islam.



May they die!
Yes, of course you must be right.

Your indulgent Mum and clustering coterie of maiden aunts might have found your little tantrums (like the one you close with) enchanting. The histrionics of a jaded juvenile were a more accurate description. Do restrain yourself. You're upsetting my parakeet.
 

Xingtian

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You have a point- I should amend my statement. Western culture may be indefinable but one can certainly take snapshots of it at a given time. For instance at the moment it’s a Euro-American boomer who moved to China, married a Chinese woman, and is now declaiming on the internet about the evils of immigration and race mixing.
 
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