The Higher Self, soul, Atman & Brahman, the unconscious, etc.

[IllusiveOwl]

zen is dicey

Tantric is where most of the children who like shiny things go. I don't know many adult practitioners who don't practice Zazen. I practice Mahyanan, which you didn't mention so...

The Seven hermetic principles still never state that there is an inherent soul.

 

[NightWatchman95]

and yet an actual zen master in my own thread told me my beliefs were in very close alignment with zazen... so i think its safe to say you speak more than you want to listen.

 

[IllusiveOwl]

and yet an actual zen master in my own thread told me my beliefs were in very close alignment with zazen... so i think its safe to say you speak more than you want to listen.

That, or your Zen Master isn't legitimate, which makes sense given your abrasiveness. Your disrespect shows an inherent superiority complex that isn't very Zen.

 

[Wintruz]

The higher self, is it us? Do we want to become it or ally with it? Is it already us? What can it do? What will it be it's involvement at our death? How is it involved with magic and astral projection? Is it even real? Are we real? Is it even worth asking?

It is the Self in the sense that it is made of the same energy as the Self which is consciousness. So, in that sense, it is of the same nature as our truest core and therefore not distinct from us. In a real way, it is us and if we unadorned ourselves of all that is inessential, we would be the same being, the same pure consciousness.

We're able to work at the level of consciousness in the same way that we're able to work at a physical level. Just as I might assemble materials and paint a portrait of myself in accordance with qualities that I want to embody, so too can we reshape the raw material of consciousness into a form that acts as a horizon for our personality to move towards. However, because it is consciousness that is ensoulling this horizon, it acts like any other conscious being, that is, it has agency. Every pattern that could ever exist, every potentiality, already exists in consciousness so we're not creating anything new here, only connecting with threads that have always existed.

So there's a bit of a game or "divine play" going on: we reach out to consciousness and reshape it into an image that meets our human psychological needs. Consciousness causes this image to come to life. We then move towards that image which, in turn, moves us closer to pure consciousness and develops our human personality too. You master both the spiritual and material worlds in one fell swoop.

In practical terms, it doesn't really matter how we conceive it, only that we strive to embody it and merge our personality with it.

 

[Konsciencia]

I am with HoldAll, I always thought that my Higher Self is another Being. But the truth is, there is no HigherSelf but yourself on a Consciousness level. I still am pondering my head if it is really me. I feel that it is me.

 

[IllusiveOwl]

“Self-remembering is the bridge between knowledge and wisdom. It is an effort to be aware of oneself in the present, to break away from whatever imaginary world one may have delved in a moment ago and return to reality. It is an instantaneous internal reorganization: pushing one’s mechanical thoughts and emotions to the background while bringing one’s Higher Self to the forefront – remembering one’s Self.” -Gurdjieff

 

[HoldAll]

“Self-remembering is the bridge between knowledge and wisdom. It is an effort to be aware of oneself in the present, to break away from whatever imaginary world one may have delved in a moment ago and return to reality. It is an instantaneous internal reorganization: pushing one’s mechanical thoughts and emotions to the background while bringing one’s Higher Self to the forefront – remembering one’s Self.” -Gurdjieff

Did someone just say 'self-remembering'??

Book – PDF - Robert E. Burton - Self-Remembering

This teacher of the Fourth Way Tradition shows how self-remembering, similar to Buddhist mindfulness and Orthodox nonattachment, relates to every aspect of the student's life and work. This book gives Burton's students an accurate transmission of his teaching on the core idea of selfremembering...

wizardforums.com

 

[silencewaits]

I wanna hear your views on this, surely folks will diverge in opinion with this stuff and I wanna hear yours

The higher self, is it us? Do we want to become it or ally with it? Is it already us? What can it do? What will it be it's involvement at our death? How is it involved with magic and astral projection? Is it even real? Are we real? Is it even worth asking?

I believe our 'self' is dependent on our current, but not normally everlasting existence. This is because for the most part, for most people, consciousness and thus the perception of individual existence will cease upon physical death.

 

[Konsciencia]

I believe our 'self' is dependent on our current, but not normally everlasting existence. This is because for the most part, for most people, consciousness and thus the perception of individual existence will cease upon physical death.

I always wonder if I am going to still be me after death.

 

[silencewaits]

I always wonder if I am going to still be me after death.

Well, maybe "me" is an outgrowth of something that has always existed. Death is simply the return. I think at the point of death there's a moment where you begin to feel "you" returning to the Cosmos. The experience being so visceral you can't find the point where you stop and eternity begins. One's 'higher self' being a projection of you in connection with this 'something'. A moment unending, devoid of fear and pain.

 

[Konsciencia]

So in other words, I will always exist?

 

[silencewaits]

So in other words, I will always exist?

I'm sure there's parts of us that will continue on. Even if we're not conscious, living beings after death. We're still a domino in a line of dominoes, so the effects of our lives will continue to further affect things even after we've passed. We exist in a web of connections and change. Every living being, no matter how great or how powerful will die. It's as natural as blinking or being born. In respect of that I choose to live so that my life and my death will both have meaning. Even if we can't avoid it, we can choose how to face the facts of mortality.

 

[Konsciencia]

I'm sure there's parts of us that will continue on. Even if we're not conscious, living beings after death. We're still a domino in a line of dominoes, so the effects of our lives will continue to further affect things even after we've passed. We exist in a web of connections and change. Every living being, no matter how great or how powerful will die. It's as natural as blinking or being born. In respect of that I choose to live so that my life and my death will both have meaning. Even if we can't avoid it, we can choose how to face the facts of mortality.

Thank you man.

Post automatically merged: Feb 17, 2025

Thank you man.

But, if The Source is us. Will our awareness will return to The Source?

 

[silencewaits]

Will our awareness will return to The Source?

I tend to think awareness of anything ceases after death for most people. Theoretically, if you develop your awareness of the supra-physical world and develop your "astral vehicle" before death - you can retain consciousness after physical existence ends. But I could not say for certain, as I myself have not gotten that far.

 

[NightWatchman95]

Apparently none of you have heard about Dvaita Vedanta? not all vedic thought is non-dualistic. just throwing out a quick correction before people think "no self" is a open and shut case. In short, its basically esoteric hinduism that understands your individual self, while dependent on the All for its existence as first cause, is not the same as the ALL/brahman. It seemed to make a lot more contextual sense the more i looked into how it basically said "don't dissolve your self, thats what gets you stuck in samsara, focus on the true god/logos and you raise yourself up to greater heights! ".

Might make a full thread about it, but not sure if i have enough forum juice yet to have anyone see it.