Was Jesus an ancient Epstein?

[throne]

We know that some magicians and mystery religion goers during that time period could be very degenerate (based on modern 'morality' standards) in their behaviors. Do you think its likely that Jesus was the same?

I've seen a lot of content by Ammon Hillman where he says that Jesus was in the garden doing drugs with children and he interprets the Greek text very differently than modern apologists do.

The PGM also has a lot of blinds that may exist also in Christian texts, he argues that the word Christ means drugs. The PGM also a lot of questionable behaviors vs modern standards, at times, like animal sacrifice or torture (like drowning a bird into milk)

What do you think?
I don't mean to offend anyone's beliefs. This is not trolling and is an actual inquiry. I used the search bar already for this question and didn't find much on Ammon or his interpretations, nor much about how the PGM magick or mystery rites, might be associated with Christianity

 

[Robert Ramsay]

Seems a bit of a stretch to me.

 

[aims]

Mark 14:51-52 states: A young man (not a child) was following Jesus, wearing nothing but a linen cloth.

When the soldiers tried to seize him, he left the linen cloth in their hands and fled naked.

Most scholars believe that this young man was the Evangelist Mark himself during his teenage years. His mother's house was located in Jerusalem, and it was the place where the Last Supper/ had taken place. He likely woke up from the noise of the crowd, wrapped himself in a linen cloth, and ran out of curiosity or anxiety to see what was happening, without belonging to the inner circle of the 12 Apostles..

 

[Yazata]

Moved to Controversy

 

[FireBorn]

Ammon is an interesting cat. I think he leans heavily into a deliberately irreverent and controversial persona. Commercially, that gets attention, podcast appearances, and eyes on his books, and the dude has to eat. I mean how else is a philologist gonna eat if not working professionally in philology?

His take is hilarious and salacious as hell (pardon the pun) but I think what he is doing is only partly clean. He often takes a secondary or highly context dependent meaning of a Greek term, treats that meaning as though it were obvious, and then carefully strings those choices together into an overarching theory. It just happens to be a theory almost perfectly engineered to tickle the collective anus of Christians across the country.

Knowing Greek does not mean every interpretation you construct from Greek is equally sound. The question is whether the proposed meanings fit the grammar, the immediate context, contemporary usage, and the wider textual and historical evidence, not merely whether those meanings can be found somewhere in a lexicon.

Is his reconstruction realistic? About as realistic as Zecharia Sitchin’s translations of Sumerian cuneiform.

Hillman is irreverent, genuinely knowledgeable within his specialty, funny as fuck, and a gifted entertainer. He is also wildly overconfident in conclusions that depend upon stacking one disputable lexical choice on top of another. Smart as fuck, but equally capable of being full of shit.

It's entertainment, I gotta be in the mood for it though.

 

[aims]

Ancient text in Greek: «Καὶ νεανίσκος τις συνηκολούθει αὐτῷ περιβεβλημένος σινδόνα ἐπὶ γυμνοῦ, καὶ κρατοῦσιν αὐτόν· ὁ δὲ καταλιπὼν τὴν σινδόνα γυμνὸς ἔφυγεν».


Sorry for quoting in Greek. I am Greek. Ask ChatGPT or Gemini about the above passage from the Gospel of Mark. Everyone will tell you that it refers to a young man and not a child. I wonder about those who believe people who supposedly know Greek and shamelessly mislead the world with fake translations of words

 

[Firetree]

what was the original Greek term used for 'Jesus was doing drugs ...' ?

 

[Aeternus]

Ammon is an interesting cat. I think he leans heavily into a deliberately irreverent and controversial persona. Commercially, that gets attention, podcast appearances, and eyes on his books, and the dude has to eat. I mean how else is a philologist gonna eat if not working professionally in philology?

His take is hilarious and salacious as hell (pardon the pun) but I think what he is doing is only partly clean. He often takes a secondary or highly context dependent meaning of a Greek term, treats that meaning as though it were obvious, and then carefully strings those choices together into an overarching theory. It just happens to be a theory almost perfectly engineered to tickle the collective anus of Christians across the country.

Knowing Greek does not mean every interpretation you construct from Greek is equally sound. The question is whether the proposed meanings fit the grammar, the immediate context, contemporary usage, and the wider textual and historical evidence, not merely whether those meanings can be found somewhere in a lexicon.

Is his reconstruction realistic? About as realistic as Zecharia Sitchin’s translations of Sumerian cuneiform.

Hillman is irreverent, genuinely knowledgeable within his specialty, funny as fuck, and a gifted entertainer. He is also wildly overconfident in conclusions that depend upon stacking one disputable lexical choice on top of another. Smart as fuck, but equally capable of being full of shit.

It's entertainment, I gotta be in the mood for it though.

Well, I watched some of his sayings a little, just a little and yeah... he is the usual philologist who makes use of controversy to hook people to his books.

Not trustworthy at all.

Mark 14:51-52 states: A young man (not a child) was following Jesus, wearing nothing but a linen cloth.

When the soldiers tried to seize him, he left the linen cloth in their hands and fled naked.

Most scholars believe that this young man was the Evangelist Mark himself during his teenage years. His mother's house was located in Jerusalem, and it was the place where the Last Supper/ had taken place. He likely woke up from the noise of the crowd, wrapped himself in a linen cloth, and ran out of curiosity or anxiety to see what was happening, without belonging to the inner circle of the 12 Apostles..

If one reads a little from the Bible, I think it is safe to note that Jesus wasn't arrested with a young boy. The word Neaniskos is never a school grade age kid. Translations such as the one of Pythagoras describe the word Neaniskos as a word for a teen aged 20-5 or even up to 40.

None of the 12 Apostles were children. Peter was married and owned a fishing boat, ran a fishing business with Andrew (his brother), partnered with two other men, James and John and paid taxes. Matthew (also known as Levi) was a tax collector, and owned a house where he threw a feast for his other tax collector friends and Jesus. Clearly none of the 12 Apostles were underaged.

Furthermore, I will debunk another stupid claim of Ammon Hillman by stating the following:

Jesus was never a child trafficker. The term lēistḗs would mean a thief by violence, an outlaw, etc. The word would never be coined with Ammon's totally bogus interpretation. Jesus historically in the Bible was accused as being the liberator of Jewish people rather than being a child trafficker or having anything to do with drugs.

And, last debunking for the discussion, about the term "Christ" meaning drugs:

We know that some magicians and mystery religion goers during that time period could be very degenerate (based on modern 'morality' standards) in their behaviors. Do you think its likely that Jesus was the same?

I've seen a lot of content by Ammon Hillman where he says that Jesus was in the garden doing drugs with children and he interprets the Greek text very differently than modern apologists do.

The PGM also has a lot of blinds that may exist also in Christian texts, he argues that the word Christ means drugs. The PGM also a lot of questionable behaviors vs modern standards, at times, like animal sacrifice or torture (like drowning a bird into milk)

What do you think?
I don't mean to offend anyone's beliefs. This is not trolling and is an actual inquiry. I used the search bar already for this question and didn't find much on Ammon or his interpretations, nor much about how the PGM magick or mystery rites, might be associated with Christianity

The word Christ comes from "Christos" which stands for the signification of "Annointed One". In Hebrew this can be equivalent of the word Messiah or Masiach. The historical context lies in the ancient anointing using olive oil.

 

[aims]

what was the original Greek term used for 'Jesus was doing drugs ...' ?

From what I know, Hillman claims that the Greek word christos Χριστός (meaning κεχρισμένος 'the anointed one', he who has been smeared with oil) refers exclusively to being anointed with hallucinogenic or psychotropic substances and ointments.


In reality, in both ancient Greek and Judaic tradition, 'anointing' was a purely religious, ritual act of consecration using olive oil and myrrh for kings and priests. It had absolutely nothing to do with hallucinogens or drugs.

Post automatically merged: Today at 7:27 AM

Well, I watched some of his sayings a little, just a little and yeah... he is the usual philologist who makes use of controversy to hook people to his books.

Not trustworthy at all.




If one reads a little from the Bible, I think it is safe to note that Jesus wasn't arrested with a young boy. The word Neaniskos is never a school grade age kid. Translations such as the one of Pythagoras describe the word Neaniskos as a word for a teen aged 20-5 or even up to 40.

None of the 12 Apostles were children. Peter was married and owned a fishing boat, ran a fishing business with Andrew (his brother), partnered with two other men, James and John and paid taxes. Matthew (also known as Levi) was a tax collector, and owned a house where he threw a feast for his other tax collector friends and Jesus. Clearly none of the 12 Apostles were underaged.

Furthermore, I will debunk another stupid claim of Ammon Hillman by stating the following:

Jesus was never a child trafficker. The term lēistḗs would mean a thief by violence, an outlaw, etc. The word would never be coined with Ammon's totally bogus interpretation. Jesus historically in the Bible was accused as being the liberator of Jewish people rather than being a child trafficker or having anything to do with drugs.

And, last debunking for the discussion, about the term "Christ" meaning drugs:



The word Christ comes from "Christos" which stands for the signification of "Annointed One". In Hebrew this can be equivalent of the word Messiah or Masiach. The historical context lies in the ancient anointing using olive oil.

 

[Firetree]

From what I know, Hillman claims that the Greek word christos Χριστός (meaning κεχρισμένος 'the anointed one', he who has been smeared with oil) refers exclusively to being anointed with hallucinogenic or psychotropic substances and ointments.

I wonder what wild logic or research led him to that conclusion ?

' Ohhhh he must have taken drugs ! '

Who is this 'Hillman' and why would any one bother with such ideas or Hillman ???

 

[Aeternus]

I wonder what wild logic or research led him to that conclusion ?

' Ohhhh he must have taken drugs ! '

Who is this 'Hillman' and why would any one bother with such ideas or Hillman ???

A con artist at best. He lacks basic Greek language knowledge. An individual with rather questionable past as well.. Some people say he was fired from St. Mary's University due to SA accusations. A lot of people also began distancing from him such as Neal (Gnostic Informant). A lot of drama and BS surrounding a con artist (Amon Hillman). The lethal combination imo

 

[HoldAll]

Short answer: no, Jesus wasn't a financier, on the contrary, he had a thing about money lenders.

Long answer: the vast majority of child sexual abuse occurs within the victim's circle of trust. The perpetrators can be men, women, adolescents, or other children; they can be fathers, uncles, grandmothers, coaches, or close family friends. It's not the celebs (including Jesus) that are the problem, it could be anybody - according to some estimates, 1 in 5-10 children is sexually abused. Reporting about Epstein was - and still is - never about raising awareness about pedophilia, it's about sensationalism, sadistic glee and voyeurism. People get excited by those cases while pretending to be oh-so appalled and concerned while repressing their anxieties because this evil is right in their midst.

Using 'Epstein' as a synonym for 'pedophile' and linking it to another celebrity, this time Jesus, is sensationalism squared. We have Ammon Hillman's Original Sin: Sex, Drugs, and the Church in the Library (it was a request, and very nearly got disallowed), and from what I remember from skimming through the book, it's about how the systematic sexual abuse of boys was secret Catholic Church policy in order to spoil them for pagan priesthood or something like that. The author's venom is directed against the Church but he doesn't seem to care about the victims at all; instead, he keeps on slobbering about 'nubile' fourteen-year old virgin priestesses, which is typical for such hypocrites. Hold out for his new bestseller, "Was Mary Magdalene really underage when she became Jesus' lover?" Read all about it, slobber slobber slobber.