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What are angels?

juji

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I worked with angels often, but found no good explanation about what they are. Probably every magical paradigm has its own answer to this. I was reading a book about etruscan deities and there are winged demons also there. At the same time I think they are just intelligence, information with no image except the one we give to them in order to make contact. I sometimes read that their existance goes beyond the abramitic religions. What do you think?
 

Eldros

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I like thinking of Cupid as an angel of love. Not in the traditional sense, but as something that carries the invisible between people.
I think angels are just the forms we give to things that move between worlds - love, desire, things we can feel but never really see...
400.jpg
 

ROL13

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In my experience (working with Shem angels)—after years of contemplating their nature and practicing theurgy, and knowing for a fact that they respond—I am still not entirely clear on what they are. I do not believe they are merely egregores; perhaps they are multidimensional beings, yet they are also part of the subconscious. In other words, it is as if we all possess, by default, the latent ability within our subconscious to interact with these "intelligences." I do not think the ritual act and evocation are merely a placebo effect; rather, I believe the ritual (inducing a semi-trance state) creates the necessary opening or mindset to connect and receive. Yet, the entire metaphysical ecosystem remains deeply mysterious to me. Perhaps the goal isn't to understand it or create a mental taxonomy, but simply to use what they offer as tools to bring out the best version of ourselves on this plane.
 

Nembra

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I worked with angels often, but found no good explanation about what they are. Probably every magical paradigm has its own answer to this. I was reading a book about etruscan deities and there are winged demons also there. At the same time I think they are just intelligence, information with no image except the one we give to them in order to make contact. I sometimes read that their existance goes beyond the abramitic religions. What do you think?
There are generally two classes of spirits people seem to call angels - often unbeknownst to the existence of the other kind. Firstly, there are spirits driven by your ultimate good (happiness, basically) - that doesn't mean prosperity or good fortune, I'm speaking of almost archetypal idea of a good life. Roughly speaking spirits of virtues. You can't really work with them in the usual sense, they won't often align with you and no ritual has authority to command them. Their existence softly implies there's a God, or at least something relatively similar. They usually appear in pairs dialoguing with each other, always beutiful but, I find, not commonly accompanied by this white, blinding light that's often associated with heaven.

Then there are all the angels you'll find summoning rituals for, ones that are used in spells and whatnot. They're, I reckon, essentially spirits of the ways virtues appear to humans, hence the more stereotypical, heavenly-pompatic visage they usually have. They do seem to command substantial power - perhaps inherited from their namesakes - but they're not always those all-good, safe servants of God some RHP practitioners seem to take them for. They do essentially exist outside of Abrahamic context, the only thing they require is some concept of objective virtue.
 

solxyz

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Some more specific questions: (1) to what extent are they distinct and independent entities vs to what extent are they manifest expressions of a head of the hierarchy (God, or more immediate archangelic superiors)? (2) To what extent do they represent fundamental cosmological principles (ie is Haniel just the angel name for Venusian energy) vs to what extent are they distinct from these cosmological principles. (3) How much and what kind of interest do they have in humans? How in contact with the material plane are they? Do they want or need anything from us? Can they be appealed to for material gain, or are they only interested in our spiritual development? Or maybe they are only concerned with their vast cosmological or historical workings and are barely aware of individual humans at all.
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There are generally two classes of spirits people seem to call angels - often unbeknownst to the existence of the other kind. Firstly, there are spirits driven by your ultimate good (happiness, basically) - that doesn't mean prosperity or good fortune, I'm speaking of almost archetypal idea of a good life. Roughly speaking spirits of virtues. You can't really work with them in the usual sense, they won't often align with you and no ritual has authority to command them. Their existence softly implies there's a God, or at least something relatively similar. They usually appear in pairs dialoguing with each other, always beutiful but, I find, not commonly accompanied by this white, blinding light that's often associated with heaven.

Then there are all the angels you'll find summoning rituals for, ones that are used in spells and whatnot. They're, I reckon, essentially spirits of the ways virtues appear to humans, hence the more stereotypical, heavenly-pompatic visage they usually have. They do seem to command substantial power - perhaps inherited from their namesakes - but they're not always those all-good, safe servants of God some RHP practitioners seem to take them for. They do essentially exist outside of Abrahamic context, the only thing they require is some concept of objective virtue.

So the angels-in-themselves and the angels-as-experienced? What is the point in saying that these are different classes of angels? And how do you know that there actually are angels-in-themselves?
 

Nembra

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So the angels-in-themselves and the angels-as-experienced? What is the point in saying that these are different classes of angels? And how do you know that there actually are angels-in-themselves?
You said in-themselves as opposed to as-experienced, not me. Both are experienced, technically speaking, and I have no idea what does it mean to things to be or not be in-themselves. The difference is more or less the one between the spirit of the fact that - for instance - kindness leads to happiness and the spirit of kindness as it actually appears in the world. They belong to completely different classes of beings, one is made of a moral principle, the other is basically a complicated elemental - an ensouled abstraction.
 
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I worked with angels often, but found no good explanation about what they are. Probably every magical paradigm has its own answer to this. I was reading a book about etruscan deities and there are winged demons also there. At the same time I think they are just intelligence, information with no image except the one we give to them in order to make contact. I sometimes read that their existance goes beyond the abramitic religions. What do you think?

Nobody can actually answer to that question.

There are so many theories about that...

Some people think they are images humans to represent some ideas, other thinks they are like what the Bible says... Then you can find the egrogore theorie....

One thing i can answer is you can call a name and not receiving the same thing than your neighbour.

One of my friends work the angel Raphael as he's describe in the Bible and he was kinda surprised when he discovered the Golden Dawn/Western Magick version of Raphael that has totally other associations.
 

juji

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Thank you, these are all interesting things to meditate about. Still no answer. I really have to ask an angel:)!
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Some more specific questions: (1) to what extent are they distinct and independent entities vs to what extent are they manifest expressions of a head of the hierarchy (God, or more immediate archangelic superiors)? (2) To what extent do they represent fundamental cosmological principles (ie is Haniel just the angel name for Venusian energy) vs to what extent are they distinct from these cosmological principles. (3) How much and what kind of interest do they have in humans? How in contact with the material plane are they? Do they want or need anything from us? Can they be appealed to for material gain, or are they only interested in our spiritual development? Or maybe they are only concerned with their vast cosmological or historical workings and are barely aware of individual humans at all.
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So the angels-in-themselves and the angels-as-experienced? What is the point in saying that these are different classes of angels? And how do you know that there actually are angels-in-themselves?
Yes. All these questions.
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I like thinking of Cupid as an angel of love. Not in the traditional sense, but as something that carries the invisible between people.
I think angels are just the forms we give to things that move between worlds - love, desire, things we can feel but never really see...
400.jpg
Interesting point of view. Invisible emotions that we send through messengers. It makes sense.
 
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I don't really get this question. It's like asking "What is a dog? I mean I have a dog and I've taken him for walks and played fetch with him, but I still don't know what a dog is."
They're benevolent spirits that are closest to God and work under God. They're the closest to the godhead and the divine in the grand hierarchy of spirits. As opposed to demons, which are the furthest and closer to the material, hence, you ask them for more material shit, and you ask angels for more selfless things. You can ask Angels for material things too but they'll only give them to you if it'll actually affect your life for the better and they take longer to deliver because they have to make sure and do it in a way that isn't harmful. Demons are a lot faster because they don't give a fuck; they'll just give you what you ask for. They don't care if it ends up hurting you or the ones you care about. Hope this helps, but something tells me you're gonna reply with something like "thanks for the info, but I still don't know what an angel is!"
 

Angelkesfarl

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There are generally two classes of spirits people seem to call angels - often unbeknownst to the existence of the other kind. Firstly, there are spirits driven by your ultimate good (happiness, basically) - that doesn't mean prosperity or good fortune, I'm speaking of almost archetypal idea of a good life. Roughly speaking spirits of virtues. You can't really work with them in the usual sense, they won't often align with you and no ritual has authority to command them. Their existence softly implies there's a God, or at least something relatively similar. They usually appear in pairs dialoguing with each other, always beutiful but, I find, not commonly accompanied by this white, blinding light that's often associated with heaven.

Then there are all the angels you'll find summoning rituals for, ones that are used in spells and whatnot. They're, I reckon, essentially spirits of the ways virtues appear to humans, hence the more stereotypical, heavenly-pompatic visage they usually have. They do seem to command substantial power - perhaps inherited from their namesakes - but they're not always those all-good, safe servants of God some RHP practitioners seem to take them for. They do essentially exist outside of Abrahamic context, the only thing they require is some concept of objective virtue.
Thank you, man. You’ve described it well, so let me provide a clear introduction to angels:
In Islam, an angel is defined as divine light emanating from God Himself. God created them from a handful of light, meaning they are conscious, perceptive beings endowed with knowledge. They are entrusted with serving God and are absolutely loyal to Him alone. Their faith in the Creator cannot be shaken, nor can they be dissuaded from serving Him.

Among them are angels who follow Gabriel; these are the angels of revelation, guidance, knowledge, religion, and rational thought.
Among them are angels who follow Michael; these are the angels responsible for sustenance and life. It is known that not a drop of water falls, not a seed grows, and no bird eats unless they distribute sustenance to it by the Creator’s command.

Angels who follow Israfil: These are the angels of praise to the Creator, and they are also the angels who control the two blasts—life and death. Israfil is depicted as an angel holding a trumpet. The trumpet is for blowing, and there are two blasts: one at the end of the world that will destroy everything beneath God’s throne, and the blast of life, from which all souls will emerge to return to their bodies and be resurrected on the Day of Judgment.

And the angels who follow the Angel of Death: They are divided into two groups. One group is for the virtuous souls; they are very beautiful and very compassionate, with forms of exquisite beauty, and they come to take the souls of the righteous and the faithful.
The other group is very severe and terrifying in appearance, and they come to take the souls of the sinners.

Then there are the heavenly angels, who do not descend to the world; they are the inhabitants of each of the seven heavens.

There are angels prostrating beneath the Throne, praising the majesty of the Creator.
There are angels called the “Travelers,” who come to the aid of all creatures.
None of these angels descend or are summoned by anyone, and no creature, regardless of its rank, can call upon them and be heard, for they move only with the permission of the Creator, Exalted and Glorious.
This is the angel.
They are known from the earliest religions themselves, and there is another conception of them that differs from other religions and ideas.
When the Creator created Adam, He commanded the angels to prostrate themselves before Adam. So they all prostrated—not in worship, but in gratitude to the Creator for creating Adam and out of love for this creature.

Islamic doctrine states that angels descend upon the prophets and messengers, and that the sending of heavenly revelations to the people of the earth has been a practice since the very beginning of humanity—right up to the final religion, Islam.
There are verses that prove that when Pharaoh said to Moses, “Bring us God and the angels before us,” he was aware in those bygone eras and knew the truth about the Creator, to whom the angels belong.

And naturally, through intellectual discourse, followers of any religion will describe goodness and attribute it to the characteristics of those angels, for they are creatures of light that cannot be seen, taking any form they wish; they embody goodness without any evil, and among them are warriors—as in the example of Lot’s village, which the angels lifted up to the heavens, then overturned it back to the earth, leveled it, and rained down upon the inhabitants of that city a deluge of filth. that tore everything apart and destroyed it.

Or they led an army of the Namus—whose presence darkened the day—that pounced upon Nimrod’s troops, draining their bodies of fluids and afflicting them with diseases until they all perished for the sake of Abraham, the father of the prophets.

Or a single cry from one of the angels of torment, vengeance, and wrath was enough to transform humans into something resembling the “miracle of the hollow palm tree”—an Arabic expression for annihilation.

Thus, by following the thread of evidence, we also conclude that among them are those with superhuman powers capable of destroying the earth or causing crops and fruits to flourish.

Now, as we continue with them, please forgive me for digressing and for the length of this discussion, but I want to provide you with a comprehensive overview,

In this brief study, I will delve into angels of a different kind: the followers of the angels Harut and Marut...!!?

Who are Harut and Marut? They are the angels of sorcery.
They are entrusted with the practice of magic as a tool of forbidden knowledge and work.
They have many angels under their command, but they are the origin: - Their mission was to teach humanity celestial magic. According to Hebrew accounts, they were angels who explained how humans could err; in another account, they descended to teach humans magic so that people could distinguish between idol worshippers and their guardian, Satan, and the demons of his kingdom—who taught people another form of magic: “black magic.”

These are the practices we see performed with the left hand.
The important thing is that “Harut and Marut” are located in Babylon, in a cave that can only be reached by riding two black dogs that carry a person there through the darkness and across countries with very swift leaps from east to west, arriving there in just a few minutes.

And everything we see attributed to Solomon is not actually from him, because he is a prophet who does not deal in magic—simply because he has no need for it. The Prophet Solomon need only pray to the Creator, and the Creator sends Gabriel to him as the bearer of the divine message; then, things happen without the need for any ritual.

There are other creatures beneath the angels called the jinn, and among them is a type we will focus on in particular: they were created from fire—and in my personal opinion, based on experience, from a powerful, blazing, radiant, and potent nuclear or solar fire.
They, too, resemble angels in form—a bright, powerful, and effective light—and are superior in power to any demon. They possess weapons, including staffs (see “magical patterns”), from which they produce lightning and fires that resemble mushrooms because they are fires with a dome-like shape; this is the description in the most precise terms given by those who have truly witnessed the phenomenon.

They are the ones whom the biblical seers described as the Creator’s angelic servants—angels of fire, like an army—in any magical text that has passed through your hands regarding the midwife; this is well-known and requires no further proof.

These are called the Great Angels, the rulers of the seven spheres:
Each sphere refers to a planetary sphere; they possess the entire sphere of a planet as well as the sphere of its lights in their regular cosmic movements. These jinn, to be precise, possess the powers of those planets and are the ones who direct them. In the seven spheres, they are fully embodied entities—not merely something like a map—and of course they have names, though this is not the place to list them. “The important thing is that they are like angels,” though not with the same power or abilities.
These entities are neither purely good nor purely evil; rather, they are changeable depending on the times, to assist you in your magical affairs. Among these, of course, are enslaving demons, harnessing them, commanding their obedience, summoning them, banishing them, subduing them, abducting them, torturing the disobedient among them, and subjugating the mighty ones.

And here I’ll leave you to figure it out on your own…
 
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