What comes after Christianity

[Yazata]

I'm sure most will have heard of the Malachy list of popes at one time. Whether or not you believe the list to be a hoax, just a fun story, inaccurate or a conspiracy – the question that's been on my mind for some time is: What will fill the vacuum if Christianity disappears?

I live in a western "judeo-christian" society where people are pretty much free to do whatever they want to as long as it doesn't harm others. Atheists or those who oppose "God" are just as free to express their ideas as others, and I sometimes think about who or what they would start opposing once "God" has left the scene.

What's your take?

 

[8Lou1]

In my spiritual endeavors i find people without god annoying. Somehow they have a different paradigm to talk from and you need translators to understand each other. Still i can see them do similar spiritual things as i do, so it is strange. It is like microsoft talking to linux, the outcome is the same, a workable pc, but the road to get there is different.

In daily life, i like the diversity of mixed ways instead of a homogenous group under god.

 

[SkullTraill]

I sometimes think about who or what they would start opposing once "God" has left the scene.

An atheist would continue the rest of their life without having to oppose anything.

I say this as someone who is opposed to organized religion. If it "disappeared" one day, then I would just continue my life, nothing would change.

Of course there are "professional victims" and "professional activists" who's entire career and life revolve around opposing certain things, and they have to come up with new things to be butthurt about to keep getting funded, so yeah, they'll find something new, that's basically how cancel culture came about anyways. When your degree is worthless "women's studies" or some shit and you have no real job except to be offended on social media, then you're damn well gonna be as offended as you can about something.

But of course, nothing usually "just disappears". Most religions today are just slowly but surely fading away into obscurity, barely noticed by anyone, and rotting from within so there is no one to "blame" or "rally against". All except one religion. The unstoppable tide of Islam. Which is still going strong and procreating like literal farm animals. Soon will probably take over most of the world, which may cause resurgence of Christianity... who knows.

 

[Yazata]

diversity of mixed ways

Yes, that's what I meant with the current situation as it still is in Western Europe. Maybe it's different in the US but when I hear people describe how they got terrorized through their Christian upbringing I find it hard to relate.

All except one religion. The unstoppable tide of Islam

This is what I kinda fear will replace Christianity in the West eventually. On the one hand because it's followers are more fanatical and on the other hand it seems like the perfect system for a dictatorship in which everybody polices everybody else - where society already is moving towards.

 

[8Lou1]

What we see here in the netherlands with moslims has a background in the reformation. Somehow politics made it happen that salafism and our dutch history combined into dark colored scarfs and everything haram. It is a sad game being played. This game is played very differently in arabic countries, which again create a form of crazyness in the minds of families with an immigrant background. Culture and religion are getting played and used for higher political goals.

That being said, if one believes in the abrahamic god and studies islam privately, it is easy to see why it is the 3th chapter in the abrahamic religion and why it is important to have a PERSONAL connection with the divine.

However, due to me having this view on and in islam, i am mostly hated by fellow moslims and am more often then not, not seen as one of them. The nicest version i got was heretic, but ive had deathcurses/get divorce curses/and more thrown at me.

Even big tariqas (islamic mystical groups aka sufism) don't like me using my knowhow as a dutch white woman. Everytime i asked for help or info i got redirected to go cook, clean and obey my husband. It is fucked up powerplay and they like to keep it like that even though the qoran tells moslims to not do that.

 

[Incognitus]

What will fill the vacuum if Christianity disappears?

I hope nothing, tho I know that’s not possible. Organized religion has killed millions of people, and I’m not just talking religious wars, but it inspires people to violence against those of opposing beliefs. Organized religion will be the downfall of humanity someday.

I hope something more nature oriented would take its place, but that’s wishful thinking.

 

[Yazata]

inspires people to violence

That's true but at the moment I think this is largely a thing of the past - in the West and for Christianity at least.

I sometimes have this idea how "the fear of God" acts in the same way as police does and that it can prevent people from doing things that will harm themselves in the end.
But I know that anybody can come with examples of how altarboys got treated etc.
It's a big picture and that naturally allows for different aspects to focus on.

 

[Incognitus]

I sometimes have this idea how "the fear of God" acts in the same way as police does and that it can prevent people from doing things that will harm themselves in the end.

I guess it depends. If a fanatic thinks their God wants them to kill, they will kill. In that case, it's fear of NOT doing what God wants in their minds.

I dunno, feels like a powder keg in the US sometimes. The Evangelicals have lost their damn minds. I never thought when I was a kid practicing drills in case of bombs from Russia being dropped that I'd ever have to worry about religious fanatic, domestic terrorists. Not a large scale of violence, but it doesn't take much of a spark to whip up a group of unhappy religious fanatics into mass violence based on past history.

 

[Roma]

Is it worth distinguishing deists from theists?

 

[8Lou1]

@Roma: i think over the years, in esp. Europe, faithful people left the church, denounced religion and became deists. It seems a natural progress to me and the only real option. That or becoming atheist. Which after conversing with a few, seems to be a natural difference.

I was very surprised at that outcome, but somewhere online i found a study were godsconsciousness/godspark was found in the subatomic particles of dna in some people, but not all.

So in conclusion of my little research back then, atheism and deism are natural states.
Religion was a mass manipulation tool and still is, with exceptions to the rule of course.

 

[Yazata]

Religion was a mass manipulation tool and still is

Yes I agree with that. Do I think that is a good thing? In essence it could be but in reality it isn't because of greed.

It's like a school class where the teacher leaves the room for half an hour.
Some kids will play with their phone or talk amongst themselves etc. No harm done.
Other kids might throw a chair through the window and tag the walls.
Now, if the teacher returns, stricter rules will be implemented.

That is the point I basically was making. We live in a time and culture where we have freedom. I'd hate to see that change.

 

[8Lou1]

Well, and i am not going the conspiracy route, the freedom you speak about is mostly fake. Powerplay in so called 3th world countries is more in the open then here, so it is easier to see. Dresscode for example seems a huge thing here (if you go geenstijl, a semi satiric news site) lots of people hate women with scarfs and vise versa. While in arabic countries (not talking about arabic peninsula) most women dress more diverse then here. They also work harder to prevent salafism and spreading of fanatism.

i am not even going to talk about the dutch government inviting the most stupid imams, while at the same time discrediting the open minded ones, setting up university courses for islamic women in housekeeping(yes that shit is real) or on purpose putting up posters of kissing scarfed ladies (were in the hivemind is that ever going to go by peacefully???????)

I for myself am as dutch as can be, with deep roots in our country. Do i have the freedom to explore them all? Nope, some things they dont want to come out in the open(by now they know it is me, but i had my share of aivd investigations. And i was only looking at the spiritual side of things, let alone id be looking for more). There are several dutchmen who, due to their power of Truth, got totally wrecked by our tax department, lost the freedom to live in the netherlands and so fort.

So what do you really mean with freedom?

 

[8Lou1]

Btw excuse me taking the dutch route, but since OP and i live there it is the easiest way to explain. If others want a more global explanation, i can provide that as well.

 

[Yazata]

Well, and i am not going the conspiracy route, the freedom you speak about is mostly fake. Powerplay in so called 3th world countries is more in the open then here, so it is easier to see. Dresscode for example seems a huge thing here (if you go geenstijl, a semi satiric news site) lots of people hate women with scarfs and vise versa. While in arabic countries (not talking about arabic peninsula) most women dress more diverse then here. They also work harder to prevent salafism and spreading of fanatism.

i am not even going to talk about the dutch government inviting the most stupid imams, while at the same time discrediting the open minded ones, setting up university courses for islamic women in housekeeping(yes that shit is real) or on purpose putting up posters of kissing scarfed ladies (were in the hivemind is that ever going to go by peacefully???????)

I for myself am as dutch as can be, with deep roots in our country. Do i have the freedom to explore them all? Nope, some things they dont want to come out in the open(by now they know it is me, but i had my share of aivd investigations. And i was only looking at the spiritual side of things, let alone id be looking for more). There are several dutchmen who, due to their power of Truth, got totally wrecked by our tax department, lost the freedom to live in the netherlands and so fort.

So what do you really mean with freedom?

What I mean:
Here gay folks can marry, walk around hand in hand, kiss etc.
People can leave their religion without repercussion.
You can do pretty much whatever you like if it doesn't harm others or their property.

You say lots of people here in NL hate western wonen that convert to islam ( or wear scarfs as you call it).
That is in a way a freedom as well. The freedom to express yourself.

I have no idea which part of our Dutch culture you as a Dutch woman ate forbidden to explore.

 

[8Lou1]

I get your drift. And that is indeed true. The freedom to do things more openly is big in Europe.

On the other hand, if you want to dive deeper into certain ages or actions, it is harder. The most cringe thing i found in combo with the divide and conquer game here in the netherlands, is the fact that berbers (people from north Africa) are hated everywhere (they still get napalm bombed in morrocco) , but in history they were the European tribe that conquered the romans and in the old greek an latin texts, they were the ones who had the golden fleece, the apples of discorda, the oldest star language, etc.

What is also hidden is that the vikings not just conquered europe, but also morrocco. We are way more family then they want to let us know.

That you dont know why i got in trouble with my research might be for the best. Some occult roads are less traveled, as it should be.

 

[Yazata]

berbers (people from north Africa) are hated everywhere,

I don't agree. And you probably know that the Dutch love different cultures.
Adolescent males who break the law and behave violently towards everybody but their own circle are hated. But nobody hates the corner shop "Turk" where we buy our vegetables, nobody hates the girl working the counter at A.H. etc.

But let's leave it. You gave me a wink so I think we're alright

 

[8Lou1]

Yeah, we are for sure alright. It is nice to talk to people who still see a human as a human and not as an enemy. It is strange to notice racism when you are white, but have colored kids. Thanks

 

[Mider2009]

They’d just have Protestantism or the Orthodox Church fill the vacuum

 

[Lmrb19]

Being someone who lives in the USA and grew up on "the Deep South" (e.g. Mississippi) where if you're not Christian you are persecuted. This means if you believe in anything other than ONLY Jesus the Christ and holy trinity, you're publically and socially persecuted. The Baha'i Faith in "the Deep South" is considered a "Black" religion since there was a big movement in the 1970s of new Baha'is who were predominately black/African-American when it's international and began in the Middle East. Christianity, at least in "the Deep South" (e.g. Mississippi, Alabama, Louisiana, Georgia, Tennessee, Kentucky, and sometimes Texas) is a social club where if you're not part of it-- since the US laws are Christian-based--then you're against and need to be converted.

Anyway, I was raised a Baha'i.

We believe in equality of the genders, the oneness of humanity, education for all (focus mainly on women since many countries don't allow women to get educated or if a family can only afford one, it's usually the male chosen), removing the gap between financial classes (e.g. rich and poor), One God, religious tolerance, service to others, and there is more but for this I wanted to make sure to include another belief of progressive revelation.

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The short version is each major religion provides the continuation of God's message through Prophets/Manifestations. Prophets/Manifestations always go to the civilization that needs it the most-- usually, ones who treat people badly-- and they confirm the previous message and add on to it.

For example, Islam recognizes Jesus as the Son of God (which is why I don't understand Muslims who become Christian).

The major world religions:

• Buddhism,
• Hinduism,
• Zoroastrianism,
• Judaism,
• Christianity,
• Islam,
• Babism (the forerunner to the Baha'i Faith like Judaism is to Christianity, basically),
• Baha'i Faith

Note: I know there is a ninth one but I don't recall the name of it because it's ancient, I think.

As someone who lived in Mississippi, USA, as a child, my family did have the KKK threaten us--even though we are white-presenting-- because of our religion and have had a burning cross in our front yard where my Mom got marshmallows and we made smores.

My ADHD made me forget where I was going with all of this. Please feel free to ask questions.


DISCLAIMER: I am not forcing my faith/religion on anyone. I am informing my personal experiences and thought a brief explanation of the faith I practice in addition to my witchcraft ( guess I'd call it that) was necessary.

 

[Nana]

I'm sure most will have heard of the Malachy list of popes at one time. Whether or not you believe the list to be a hoax, just a fun story, inaccurate or a conspiracy – the question that's been on my mind for some time is: What will fill the vacuum if Christianity disappears?

I live in a western "judeo-christian" society where people are pretty much free to do whatever they want to as long as it doesn't harm others. Atheists or those who oppose "God" are just as free to express their ideas as others, and I sometimes think about who or what they would start opposing once "God" has left the scene.

What's your take?

Durkheim did the most to answer this question I think.
When people talk about religion they focus on the tradition's value systems and rituals, but Durkheim made an observation that is really easy to see in the U.S.; Religion is not about control. It's not about our values. It's not about our spirituality. Religion is about what team you're on. Religion is social shorthand setting up a presumption of behavior even though we aren't related by blood or culture. This is usually a good thing because we'd all rather not have our first concern when meeting a person be is he going to eat me?
Consider the amount of community that exist between France and England despite being bloody enemies for most of their histories. Look at the moral underpinning behind rescuing the Jews from Nazi Germany by people who ostensibly hated Jews almost as much as the Nazis did.
Religion establishes relationships before it does anything else and its greatest strengths lie in it's apolitical nature; Religion's unifying principles rely on common material values based on spiritual principles. It balances political interests and obliges seeking a third option to zero sum situations. Spaces like this are where differing paradigms come together to determine more commonalities between differing perspectives.
Universally, religion becomes toxic when it becomes invested in a people's relationship to material power, a dynamic we've been watching unfold in both Christianity and al Islam recently with the Islamic Caliphate & the Roman Catholic Church. Dreams of religious hegemony started more than 1500 years ago flourish into nightmares that would shame their authors.

So what happens after Christianity? One can only hope that whatever happens next they avoid the errors of Umar and Charlemagne.